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Teac FD-235GF 3156-u replacement
22 messages - Expand all gcd View profile Hi all, I have an Advantest network analyser that uses a Teac FD-235GF 3156-U floppy drive. Teac cannot/willnot provide any information on the drive or a suitable teac replacement. They tell me it's a proprietary drive and to contact Advantest. Advantest won't help either, the analyser is past service support life. Anyone have a collection of NOS or even used FD-235GF 3156-U drives I can buy ( want around 3-5) Or - anyone have any info on the teac 235-gf apart from the teac.jp website glossy and any knowledge of a suitable replacement? If I can determine what the jumper settings mean perhaps I can find another drive that would suit. Anyone have a copy of the service manual for the drive that identifies the jumper settings? The jumper configuration for the drive as installed in the 3762ah is per the following list. A1-B1,B4-C4,B3-C3,D4-E4, F1-G1 D1-D2, E2-E3, G3-G4 Any help appreciated Thanks Greg
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More options Feb 21, 5:48 pm More options Feb 20, 8:57 pm
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Baron View profile - Show quoted text That could just be a standard PC floppy drive. Teac FD-235's are/used to be used in IBM compatible PC's. I'm sure I have some kicking around. I'll have a look on Monday when I get into work. -Best Regards: Baron.
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gcd View profile "Baron" wrote in message news:[email protected]... - Show quoted text Hi Baron, the PC drives are FD-235 HF not GF as far as I've been able to identify and the jumper set is different. For the most part I reckon all I need is to know the jumper matrix settings, from there I should be able to sort out modifying any current drive to suit. However, if you do find some GF drives I would be most interested. Thanks for the help Greg
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More options Feb 21, 7:20 pm
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gcd View profile "Baron" wrote in message news:[email protected]... - Show quoted text Hi Baron, the PC drives are FD-235 HF not GF as far as I've been able to identify and the jumper set is different.
More options Feb 21, 7:21 pm
For the most part I reckon all I need is to know the jumper matrix settings, from there I should be able to sort out modifying any current drive to suit. However, if you do find some GF drives I would be most interested. Thanks for the help Greg
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Larry View profile "gcd" wrote in message news:[email protected]... "Baron" wrote in message news:[email protected]... - Show quoted text Hi Baron, the PC drives are FD-235 HF not GF as far as I've been able to identify and the jumper set is different. For the most part I reckon all I need is to know the jumper matrix settings, from there I should be able to sort out modifying any current drive to suit. However, if you do find some GF drives I would be most interested. Thanks for the help Greg
More options Feb 21, 8:31 pm
*** Do any of these help? http://www.teac.com/DSPD/pdf/3fd0105a.pdf http://www.google.com.au/search?num=50&hl=en&safe=off&rlz=1B3GGGL_en_... http://www.hkinventory.com/public/OfferInventResult.asp?Order=1&pnums... Larry
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gcd View profile "Larry" wrote in message news:[email protected]... - Show quoted text Hi Larry, thanks for the links - unfortunately not much use I'm afraid. I hadn't seen that pdf on the teac site but as it was about HG to HF differences no mention of the GF drive. I'm particularly looking for the GF drive not the HF drive. The jumper pad on this drive allows for all sorts of non standard pinout configurations such as density select on pin 6 rather than 2 etc. The problem is some of these interfaces have changed over time, for example the density select can be either an input or an output or both depending on the drive and the controller and without the jumper data I'm not sure how the drive is actually configured to operate.
More options Feb 21, 10:23 pm
The controller on the drive is a T4A34F, again no luck in finding any info on this chip to allow me to identify what pin goes to what jumper. If anyone has a datasheet on that teac IC that would also be of some use. Thanks Greg
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Phillip Remaker View profile You might want to pose this question to the floppy hardware gurus at "Individual Computers." They make a product called the "Catweasel" which reads all floppy formats known to man. as such, they proabably have some experience with drives. http://siliconsonic.de/contact/contact_e.htm Or Tim Mann is also a floppy guru. http://www.tim-mann.org/catweasel.html
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More options Feb 21, 11:25 pm
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Baron View profile - Show quoted text I've made a note about that difference ! I have some weird HP kit kicking about with 3.5" floppies in them ! Without looking I'm sure that they are Teac drives. I'll find out tomorrow. -Best Regards: Baron.
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More options Feb 22, 10:21 am
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Baron View profile - Show quoted text -
More options Feb 23, 12:01 pm
Hi Greg, I've had a look through a number of bits of HP kit ! They are all Teac FD-235-HF's I'm afraid. I'm very sorry about that ! I felt sure that I could help. :-( -Best Regards: Baron.
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gcd View profile "Baron" wrote in message news:[email protected]... - Show quoted text Hi Baron, no problems. Thanks for looking though. I've had some success using a standard pc drive. Had to use DS0 rather than DS1 (expected) and needed to ensure the drive was using disk change on pin 34. The only thing that is still a little peculiar is the density select and whether it's an input/output or both. Using a standard PC drive I need to use a HD disk but cover over the HD hole and that seems to work reliably. On the original drive I would use HD without covering up the hole. The only issues I end up with is that the drive light is always 1/2 on when not in use. I'll keep looking for FD-235GF data and playing around. i'ts almost sorted now Thanks
More options Feb 24, 1:43 am
Greg
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Franc Zabkar View profile On Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:43:49 +1100, "gcd" put finger to keyboard and composed: >I've had some success using a standard pc drive. Had to use DS0 rather than >DS1 (expected) and needed to ensure the drive was using disk change on pin >34. The only thing that is still a little peculiar is the density select and >whether it's an input/output or both. Using a standard PC drive I need to >use a HD disk but cover over the HD hole and that seems to work reliably. On >the original drive I would use HD without covering up the hole. The only >issues I end up with is that the drive light is always 1/2 on when not in >use. >I'll keep looking for FD-235GF data and playing around. i'ts almost sorted >now >Thanks >Greg
More options Feb 24, 3:21 pm
This URL suggests that pin 2 is an input to the drive: http://pinouts.ru/Storage/InternalDisk_pinout.shtml I suggest you look at the datasheet for an old multi-IO chip such as were used on 486 and Pentium motherboards, before the functions were incorporated into the chipset. For example, here is the datasheet for a Winbond W83757F: http://www.datasheetarchive.com/datasheets/Datasheet-022/DSA00379504.pdf
Amongst the View profile Franc ZabkarFDC pins is RWC, Reduced Write Current. "This signal can be used on two-speed disk drives to select the transfer rate." On Sun, 22 Feb 2009 14:23:57 +1100, "gcd" put finger to keyboard Logic 0 = 250 Kb/s and composed:Kb/s Logic 1 = 500 >such as density an "open-drain rather thanwith 24The sink It is described as select on pin 6 output pin 2 etc. mA problem is some of >these interfaces have changed over time, for example the density select can capability". >be either an input or an output or both depending on the drive and the I've seen this pin used the jumper data I'm not but how 3.5" >controller and withoutin 2-speed 5.25" drives, surenot in the drive is drives. It configured to operate. >actuallycould be that the HD hole in the diskette tells the [PC] drive what write current to use, but the drive does not report the diskette type to the controller. FWIW, this document refers to FD55-GFR 5.25" drives: http://www.teac.com/DSPD/pdf/5fd0050a.pdf Does your Advantest network analyser write 1.44MB or 720KB of data to the diskettes? Itstrap and an odd if the drive were writing to the There is an LG would seem I strap that define how the drive behaves diskette as if it were a 720KB lo-den type while the controller were in lo-den and hi-den modes. transferring data at a hi-den (500 Kb/s) rate. >The controller on the drive is a T4A34F, again no luck in finding any info Could it be that your currentidentifyis operating at a 250Kb/s data If anyone >on this chip to allow me to setup what pin goes to what jumper. rate, and that youron that teac IC that would also be of some use. >has a datasheet diskette's capacity is being reduced to 720KB? Could it be that the original FDD uses the "RWC" pin as an output >Thanks rather than an input, and that it communicates the diskette type to >Greg the analyser, in which case the analyser could automatically adjust the data rate to suit??? In the latter case, if the analyser doesn't get any feedback from the drive, perhaps it defaults to a lo-den data - Franc Zabkar like to experiment with a pull-down or pullup resistor rate. You might -- this pin. on Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email. - Franc Zabkar Reply Reply to author Forward -Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email. From:
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More options Feb 24, 4:48 pm
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Franc Zabkar View profile On Wed, 25 Feb 2009 08:48:06 +1100, Franc Zabkar
More options Feb 24, 4:55 pm
put finger to keyboard and composed: >On Sun, 22 Feb 2009 14:23:57 +1100, "gcd" > put finger to keyboard >and composed: >>such as density select on pin 6 rather than 2 etc. The problem is some of >>these interfaces have changed over time, for example the density select can >>be either an input or an output or both depending on the drive and the >>controller and without the jumper data I'm not sure how the drive is >>actually configured to operate. >FWIW, this document refers to FD55-GFR 5.25" drives: >http://www.teac.com/DSPD/pdf/5fd0050a.pdf >There is an LG strap and an I strap that define how the drive behaves >in lo-den and hi-den modes.
There is also an In-Use (IU) jumper set that defines the conditions under which the in-use LED turns on. The standard jumpering for a PC AT system is to illuminate the LED whenever Drive Select is active, whether or not the drive is actually doing anything. Is it possible that the controller is constantly checking the DiskChange pin and thereby activating the LED? - Franc Zabkar -Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
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gcd View profile
More options Feb 25, 3:46 am
"Franc Zabkar" wrote in message news:[email protected]... - Show quoted text Hi again Franc, I've been across all the jumpers on the drive I'm playing with and none appear to affect the dim led. it goes off but I'll keep playing around if I can't find the info I'm after Cheers Greg
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gcd View profile "Franc Zabkar" wrote in message news:[email protected]... - Show quoted text Hi Franc, yes - pin 2 determines the density of the drive which is usally related to the speed of the drive. Some fdc chips expect this to be sent to the dhip from the drive, some expect to send it out to the drive and others are bi-directional. Just depends on the age of the drive and the controller, as things changed from shugart to pc format interface. This is why I'd like to get the jumper info - it would tell all.
More options Feb 25, 3:46 am
I've had a bit of play with pull ups with no luck but I'll persist :) Thanks for the links and suggestions, mind you, if all I end up with is a light 1/2 on I can live with that - just need to ensure the configuration i end up with is reliable in terms of data storage Greg
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Baron View profile gcd Inscribed thus: > "Franc Zabkar" wrote in message > news:[email protected]... >> On Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:43:49 +1100, "gcd" >> put finger to >> keyboard and composed: >>>I've had some success using a standard pc drive. Had to use DS0 >>>rather than DS1 (expected) and needed to ensure the drive was using >>>disk change on pin 34.
More options Feb 25, 7:09 am
DS1 (Drive Select) was the result of some bright spark realising that a twist in the cable could be used to determine which drive was "A" In practice it probably saved a lot of money for the manufacturers and confused techies ! >>>The only thing that is still a little peculiar is the density >>>select and whether it's an input/output or both. It sticks in my mind that it was always an output in the sense that it was used to detect the difference between 720/144 Mb disks and set the
rotational speed, 300/360 rpm I belive. >>>Using a standard PC drive I need to use a HD disk but cover over the >>>HD hole and that seems to work reliably. On the original drive I >>>would use HD without covering up the hole. I wonder if that is anything to do with difference in the material used for the magnetic coating. >>>The only issues I end up with is that the drive light is always 1/2 >>>on when not in use. >>>I'll keep looking for FD-235GF data and playing around. i'ts almost >>>sorted now >>>Thanks >>>Greg
-Best Reagrds: Baron.
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Franc Zabkar View profile On Wed, 25 Feb 2009 12:09:23 +0000, Baron put finger to keyboard and composed: >gcd Inscribed thus: >>>>The only thing that is still a little peculiar is the density >>>>select and whether it's an input/output or both. >It sticks in my mind that it was always an output in the sense that it
More options Feb 25, 3:06 pm
>was used to detect the difference between 720/144 Mb disks and set the >rotational speed, 300/360 rpm I belive.
The IBM PC AT BIOS source listing indicates that IBM used data rates of 500Kbps, 300Kbps, 250Kbps, and "reserved". In future designs, the latter became 1Mbps and was assigned to 2.88MB FDDs. The 3.5" 720KB and 1.44MB diskettes are both spun at 300 RPM, the difference being that the latter has twice as many sectors per track (18 vs 9). This results in data rates of 250Kb/s and 500Kb/s. Dual speed 5.25" drives could spin at either 300RPM or 360RPM depending on the density. A 1.2MB drive with 15 sectors/track would spin at 360RPM, whereas a 360KB drive with 9 sectors/track would spin at 300RPM. Although dual speed 1.2MB drives existed (I have two), IBM accounted for the case where a 360KB DD 300RPM (250Kbps) diskette is used in a HD fixed speed 360RPM drive by configuring the controller's digital data separator with a matching 300Kbps data rate. AFAIK the dual speed facility was never used on the PC platform. Instead pin 2 was used to signal reduced write current. - Franc Zabkar -Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
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Baron View profile - Show quoted text Thanks for the refresh ! I see that I've confused the 5.25" & 3.5" drives. Its a long time since I played around with the old stuff.
More options Feb 25, 4:36 pm
My original IBM AT is still under the bench collecting dust and heavens knows what livestock is living in it. I've still got the full hight 360K drive as well. -Best Regards: Baron.
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Franc Zabkar View profile On Wed, 25 Feb 2009 21:36:30 +0000, Baron put finger to keyboard and composed: >My original IBM AT is still under the bench collecting dust and heavens >knows what livestock is living in it. I've still got the full hight >360K drive as well. I have many of the schematics for the original IBM PC/AT, including the 360KB FDD. Here is the FDD/HDD controller: http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/PC-AT/FDC_HDC/ This sheet shows the floppy interface: http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/PC-AT/FDC_HDC/FDC_HDC_Sht4.JPG - Franc Zabkar -Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
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More options Feb 26, 12:38 am
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Baron View profile Franc Zabkar Inscribed thus: - Show quoted text Nice ! Are you Ok with me bookmarking that url ? -Best Reagrds: Baron.
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More options Feb 26, 6:46 am
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Franc Zabkar View profile On Thu, 26 Feb 2009 11:46:24 +0000, Baron put finger to keyboard and composed: - Show quoted text All my stuff is public. I just hope IBM is OK with it. - Franc Zabkar -Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
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More options Feb 26, 2:18 pm
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Baron
Feb 26, 4:51 pm
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